Welcome to future home of Freedomware Marketing. The Tux Project is going to be shifting gears a bit. This site is set to become a grass-e-roots website where we can all work together to openly collaborate on promoting the use of Freedomware in our local communities. Whether you are a business owner who uses or offers Freedomware solutions, or an individual enthusiast. You will find that this is the place for you to share your promotional ideas and work together collaboratively in order to make them a reality.
Declaration of Lindependence
Yes, that sounds like an interesting idea. We can do a tribute. Most nations have some sort of Independence day right? People may want to use their nation's version of the document [Declaration of Independence] as a model or not. We can put up all of them on a website. What day should we designate International Day of Lindependence?
This seems like something that can really grow. There are many possibilities.
I think this metaphor has been used already for various FOSS things, so we may want to research.
And I also think we already have some contributions that in not necessarily poetic fashion describe people's Lindependence (getnix ..?)
Lindependance in Pomeroy WA 99347
Here in WA State the home of Microsoft a lot of people don't know anything about GNU/Linux and those who do have been offended by some guy trying to force them to use it. I'm in South East WA State next to Idaho and this area is very Non-Linux mainly because of Ignorance (not in a bad way). There are 1,500 People in my town, 31,293 in Lewistion Idaho, 7,244 in Clarkston WA, 1,125 in Asotin WA, and 2,676 in Dayton WA. All within 30 - 45 miles of Pomeroy WA. That comes to a total of 43,838 People that may be potentially covered not to mention the local LUG in Walla Walla WA that might come down.
I would love to come down to California for the Media exposure to Ultumix GNU/Linux but I think that it is more important to reach out to this larger community. If we could combine forces by linking via skype and having volunteers with Digital cameras record the event and send it to the media and put it up online. I am going to try to get a Rock Band together and have a video game competition as well as an Ultumix GNU/Linux demonstration.
Justin Breithaupt
PO Box 485
Pomeroy WA 99347
ultumix@mindblowingidea.com
208-750-5628
www.mindblowingidea.com
www.ultumix.com
I (and others I am sure)
I (and others I am sure) feel constrained by the deadline for LIN08. There is only so much that can be done. The other problem helping Felton is that some projects cannot be followed to conclusion without a warm body in Felton to tie loose ends together there or put finishing touches (or maybe even do extensive work from Felton).
The guys working closely with Felton apparently can accomplish the job they have designed when supported with some bucks, but where does that leave others that want to help? Some amount can be done and will be, but the greatest impact would be if LIN08 would be taken to other cities and united with Felton.
My suggestion is to join the LIN08 mailing list if you haven't (email helios or lcafiero) and to start putting anything you implement online so that others (who may hear about LIN08 over time) can follow your lead and work more directly with you.
I hope I find ways to contribute, but I am thinking more long term than July08. Hopefully, I'll put stuff up, too.
Well looks like someone...
...really liked your title. [url=http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2008/02/linependence-2008.html]Lindependence 2008[/url] It is good to see that the ideas here are inspiring others. :D
Only after having read the
Only after having read the article and then some did I realized the cleverness in the title.
Why was "LIN" separated from "dependence"? Ah, because the town will become Linux dependent ;)
Maybe afterwards they will declare their official "Lindependence" and not go back.
Anyway, the idea didn't necessarily come from here.... but we'll take credit :0
I think it is safe...
...to say that we were a part of this idea in one way or another. http://thetuxproject.com/linux_town
The idea for Lindependence 2008
Hi, land0 --
Yes, you would be right in saying that the Tux Project was "a part of [the Lindependence 2008] idea in one way or another." Much of the discussion for Lindependence 2008 that took place here had a great deal to do with the formation of this project.
I am grateful to the Tux Project for its input, so thank you to all who contributed.
[Someone in another posting somewhere else -- I wish I could remember where -- said that Lindependence meant "dependence on Linux." I don't necessarily agree that anyone is "dependent" on any system, but rather this project provides a way for people to see how digital freedom works so they can make an educated choice. And when they see this, as we all have, I think they will chose freedom software over proprietary software.]
Larry Cafiero
HeliOS Solutions West
Felton, California
This is exactly precisely what...
...The Tux Project was created to do. So as you can imagine theobroma and I were completely stoked when we started to see our daydream about The Tux Project become a reality. Some people may not realize this but The Tux Project is still in it's infancy and for it to already have pulled off Linux Day, be a part of Freedomware-Gamefest 2007 and what has grown into and become LINdependence Day 2008 is huge. We have only begun to load the passengers we have not even been taxied down the runway let alone lifted off of the ground here! I hope that that may put what we are doing here into perspective. We are still laying the foundation. I know that many people have gotten frustrated at the speed at which The Tux Project is moving. But if we started putting up the walls while the cement was still wet it would surely crumble would it not?
Also it is equally important that all of the members to the Tux Project that want to support LINDependence day get involved. Become part of the solution. If you are close enough to Felton CA, or have the ability to get there let [url=http://thetuxproject.com/user/61]lcafiero[/url] know you are coming and for how long you will be able to participate. If you are not able to make it but can spare .50 cents or a buck then go on over and hit the PayPal donation button for the event.
>> We are still laying the
>> We are still laying the foundation. I know that many people have gotten frustrated at the speed at which The Tux Project is moving. But if we started putting up the walls while the cement was still wet it would surely crumble would it not?
Would a $1 million donation help speed things up?
Ah, too bad I can't help you there.
But here is what I can do http://thetuxproject.com/node/292 .
>> So as you can imagine theobroma and I were completely stoked ....
Saturday is my "busy day." Yesterday (Saturday), I was also running on very little sleep, yet I could not control myself and stop thinking about LINdependence 2008. I managed periodically to stop and write down what I had in mind.
This event, because of its slant towards the US (July 4th etc), may very well launch the US to the top of the pro-Linux environments charts before the year comes to an end.
Yes, I doubt it, too. :/ And if it did, the rest of the world (except for a few select countries like the one that really likes to knight billionaires) would catch up fairly quickly as they instituted similar or better projects.
And that's all good. Anything to spur us all forward is good.
By the way, land0, do you have any suggestions on how to procede when we have a subproject or idea for this event but want to work it through on a forum topic by itself or elsewhere. I haven't been keeping up with the "projects" setup and what not. [Did they disappear or do I simply not remember well how to find them?] My attack right now would be to start a new forum topic for each one and perhaps a parallel page inside a LINdependence 2008 wikibook. The topics might be minor though which is why I hesitate to make it its own item within the "GNU/Linux Promotional Ideas" forum category. But that might not matter.
Anyway, on with the show. There is much much to do and very little time in which to do it.
Believe it...
...or not.
[quote]Would a $1 million donation help speed things up?
Ah, too bad I can't help you there.[/quote]
That is ok because what you are doing here is worth a million dollars. IMO donating 1 million is no different than donating your time, sweat, blood and tears to any given project.
Even if I misunderstand where you are coming from, from time to time. :p ;)
As for the project pages we will be making some changes that will enable us to pursue some of ideas here in a more organized manner. In the meantime you should probably use the forum as you proposed.
>> That is ok because what
>> That is ok because what you are doing here is worth a million dollars.
That's VERY generous on your part. I hadn't thought to charge more than $10 per word, but now I am reconsidering.
Truth be told, I have a need to post on these sorts of topics. It's like a drug. I wish more people would share my addiction. Misery loves company.
But I will try to divert some of that energy into producing other content besides postings since you can't live on postings and water alone.
I think if *you* charged *me* $1/word, I'd be more precise and efficient.
Anyway, this LINdependence 2008 in Felton has me really psyched. Hopefully the feeling will wear down enough for me to get to business and think calmly and rationally.
OK. Deep breath.
That's better.
[For anyone that is confused.. the $$ to post is a joke.]
Maximizing bang for buck
I posted twice at http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2008/02/linependence-2008.html with some ideas and reaching out to include thetuxproject in a global or at least national effort that would be headquartered at Felton.
I plan to start up new threads here to work on some sort of Linux Town event (probably with some contact with the Felton effort to take place in July). Would love to combine efforts. Maybe the LINdependence 2008 coordinators have another forum in mind to better coordinate things?
I said something like that.
>> Someone ... said that Lindependence meant "dependence on Linux."
I said something like that. Not dependence that you can't break, rather that for a month say, a town would voluntarily let themselves become dependent on Linux. I mean if Linux is what is running your PC, that you are dependent on Linux, even if voluntarily.
No chains, no, not those (unless you mean the voluntary type of shackles).
Example: I depend on Linux to get me through the day. A new whole town will depend on Linux to get them through the day.
And then there is also possibly that the town will be celebrating its "Independence" from Microsoft, Linux style.
I think Lindependence is at least a little catchy.
How about as a logo a waving flag of some sort with some sort of Tux/penguin on it. Oh, or how about some sort of four colored flag with a penguin coming out of it (tearing through it). Flag would be a natural theme for an Independence sort of event.
Sort of.
Yes, and let's have a logo contest. Maybe after we get an initial draft logo and this thing gains momentum.
I had a reply for that I was meaning to put up (and I suppose I will shortly). Is there a preferred forum up yet for brainstorming and planning this event (at least to receive community feedback)? If so, I'll try and start posting there. I'll reply to the linuxlock.blogspot announcement page soon with some ideas.
The Linux town thread over here is a little large and full of diverse ideas (not focused on a specific event), so I'd rather start or pick up on a new thread somewhere. BUT I do want to participate on a Linux Town type of event. If Felton is a private affair (meaning that someone is executing their own plan and wants to have control and not be distracted by a "committee" etc), then I want to continue brainstorming in a more general sense. In this case, I like the name Lindependence 2008 and the theme helios mentioned and would like for this to be more of an umbrella theme to represent many such efforts. In other words, I would like to see if more "Linux Towns" can spring up over the upcoming months and be able to share in the same sort of event.
OK. I understand that focusing limited resources on one town specifically might be a good idea (a pilot perhaps), but many people may want to help out but (a) have no intention of going to Felton but are willing to do something locally for that occasion, (b) want to contribute, but such contributions can be shared and reused (eg, not $$ since that can't exactly be reused).
Hope neither funds nor anything else becomes a point of tension. I think a major goal should be to get people to do things even if not in Felton, though I think helios is more interested in simply getting something really big to happen somewhere.
Anyway, seeing as this is not an official Tux Project, I would like if you guys rename maybe to "Lindependence 2008: Felton" or at least not mind us using Lindependence 2008: XXXX.
I want to help you guys in some way if I can, but in the FOSS spirit, I always like to reserve the right to fork/branch off if I think a different direction if better.
Any thoughts on the name thing? Also, would you guys mind clarifying the scope, rational, intentions of Lindependence 2008, given that it seems to be distinct from what was discussed here. This way I don't start stepping on toes, or becoming a liability, or waste anyones time unnecessarily. I can see myself contributing to both (or more) projects, but I like always to be clear on what is up.
Thanks, and good luck, cause whatever happens it should be good.
"Dependence on Linux" -- a reply to the reply
Jose --
Discussion on this issue might get a little unwieldy, so maybe another forum would be better suited to this. Nevertheless, I wanted to address some of your response to my "dependence on Linux" comment.
You said:
'I said something like that. Not dependence that you can't break, rather that for a month say, a town would voluntarily let themselves become dependent on Linux. I mean if Linux is what is running your PC, that you are dependent on Linux, even if voluntarily.'
And I reply:
Yes, you're right: We "depend" on the things we use in our lives to work. But in my opinion, the word "dependence" casts a somewhat clinical cloud over the discussion -- by clinical, I mean that the word is used to define things like, say "chemical dependence" as a euphemism for drug addiction or "alcohol dependence" for alcoholism, etc. I know you didn't mean that, but the word "dependence" has become a sort of a "code word" for addiction, and I'd prefer to avoid it.
I know this is more linguistic semantics than anything important, but it deserves mentioning.
You said:
How about as a logo a waving flag of some sort with some sort of Tux/penguin on it. Oh, or how about some sort of four colored flag with a penguin coming out of it (tearing through it). Flag would be a natural theme for an Independence sort of event . . . . Yes, and let's have a logo contest. Maybe after we get an initial draft logo and this thing gains momentum.
I said:
We currently have a initial logo of Tux with a chainsaw (with the word "Linux" on the chainsaw) and a broken chain to an iron ball that says "M$".
As for gaining momentum, the first domino has fallen.
You said:
If Felton is a private affair (meaning that someone is executing their own plan and wants to have control and not be distracted by a "committee" etc), then I want to continue brainstorming in a more general sense.
I replied:
It's not "private" at all -- anyone can participate and contribute to it. Ken Starks (helios) and I are facilitating the project as . Forgive me if this sounds harsh -- and I certainly don't mean to sound that way -- but frankly the time for talk is over, and the time for work has begun. We've laid the groundwork for this project over the last several months here in Felton -- discussions on TuxProject.com and elsewhere have attested to this, and it's time to start reaping what we've sown.
You said:
In this case, I like the name Lindependence 2008 and the theme helios mentioned and would like for this to be more of an umbrella theme to represent many such efforts. In other words, I would like to see if more "Linux Towns" can spring up over the upcoming months and be able to share in the same sort of event.
OK. I understand that focusing limited resources on one town specifically might be a good idea (a pilot perhaps), but many people may want to help out but (a) have no intention of going to Felton but are willing to do something locally for that occasion, (b) want to contribute, but such contributions can be shared and reused (eg, not $$ since that can't exactly be reused).
I replied:
First of all, we should all be evangelizing for FOSS in our communities 24/7, or at least to our abilities and comfort level. I think you and I agree that doing this for the first time in Felton, where the groundwork is already in place, and seeing how it works, is better than spreading our resources thin in doing this in several places at once before we know the benefits and liabilities. Going forward, a good example how Lindependence 2008 can spread is having Lindependence 2008 work in tandem with Software Freedom Day in September, where both groups can join organizational forces with mechanisms already in place.
Going forward, there can be hundreds, thousands of "Lindependence 2008: [Your town here] (and this will be discussed later). But at this point, I would like to focus on this project and bring to others what we experience.
On the issue of money: I don't agree with your statement that money "can't exactly be reused." Actually, it can. Assuming we get enough money to cover the costs of this project, there's no reason we can't pass what's left to other projects.
You said:
Hope neither funds nor anything else becomes a point of tension. I think a major goal should be to get people to do things even if not in Felton, though I think helios is more interested in simply getting something really big to happen somewhere.
I replied:
Helios has long been an advocate of all things FOSS, and he's the living example of the expression, "Walk the walk, talk the talk." I can't speak for him, but I don't think the reason he is involved in this project is to "simply [get] something really big to happen somewhere." His involvement comes from years of commitment to FOSS, and to imply that he's doing this for the attention is a little shortsighted.
You said:
Anyway, seeing as this is not an official Tux Project, I would like if you guys rename maybe to "Lindependence 2008: Felton" or at least not mind us using Lindependence 2008: XXXX.
I want to help you guys in some way if I can, but in the FOSS spirit, I always like to reserve the right to fork/branch off if I think a different direction if better.
I replied:
Again, let me stress that doing it once somewhere, seeing how it works and building on the experience would far outweigh any fork in the project at this point. Naturally, we'd welcome your input. But I can't stop you if you want to do a Lindependence 2008: XXXX on July 4 . I have to leave this somewhat unanswered at this point because I'll have to discuss this with others.
Larry Cafiero
HeliOS Solutions West
A major goal I'd wanted to
The short version of this long reply is:
-- Thanks for the reply. I now have a better idea and am happy to hear that the effort is open to ideas and sharing.
Also included:
-- There is a brief discussion on pos/negs of images surrounding naming/logos/etc for this project.
-- Plan for some amount of failure and keep expectations modest. There can be a significant victory while coming up short. Such a victory should not be overshadowed if the most ambitious of goals are not achieved.
-- It's possible that having this effort coordinate with similar efforts will enhance the project and help generate greater results in Felton. Ultimately remember that it is the openness of the work around Freedomware that is its biggests asset. Surprises happen all the time when something is kept open and the community is allowed to have a real stake in a project. Not always will (all) the best ideas or significant work come from the inner circle (contrast Linus + a few friends to Linus + Linux community of today). At the same time, it's recognized that LINdependence 2008 is a beginning.
-- We both agree that having a focused effort on Felton is desirable. I understand that this is what you and Ken will focus on. I will try to tap into otherwise unused resources. Yes, this is mostly talk from my part at this point.
*****
A major goal I'd wanted to achieve (maybe achieved already) from this conversation was to better understand the effort and see what options remain open. I don't know the level of commitment I will be willing to give, but I saw no point in beating around the bush or delaying weeks before knowing more precisely what is up with this project.
I completely agree it is time for action and not merely words. This is why I figured that a vision was already decided and the project would move in that direction possibly expecting few distractions.
*****
LINdependence.
I was trying to understand the various uses of that word and possible impact. Ordinarily I agree with your take, and the tux chainsaw logo is consistent there. But, do think about the image LINdependence could bring. Yes, "LIN" accentuates the Linux relationship, but it has the side effect of partially accentuating "dependence".
This is what led me to this phrasing "..celebrating its 'Independence' from Microsoft, Linux style" as one possible interpretation of that phrase. Additionally, it is true that this town will voluntarily take on a change for this event, and that change is dependence on Linux. Being "dependent" also shows that the thing one depends on is or is believed to be dependable.
As long as we have more positives than negatives as concerns the names/logos/images surrounding this effort, there should be more positives than negatives to come out of it :)
*****
You should prepare for a certain percentage of failure, but since this was announced ahead of time, giving Microsoft and others ample time to inject their poison and big bucks, and is being done without professionals executing some sort of sandboxed mock-up, a moderate amount success will actually be a great success. Keep this in mind.
If 20% like the change, that 20% is much larger than the 5% or less desktop Linux market share. This extrapolates to millions of Americans (to keep the discussion at the national level) that are missing out on their preferred OS possibly because they have just not had the support network or come into contact with the right distro or ever given Linux a fair taste.
*****
Despite the "independence" theme, participants should understand that saying yes to Linux does not mean saying no to Windows (though certainly you may). Adding Linux to your household is adding an asset, especially when there is so much potential there with such a huge software repository available at the click of a mouse. A selection that keeps growing and improving and is accessible for %0 and can be modified and reused in a tailored way again for $0.
*****
>> First of all, we should all be evangelizing for FOSS in our communities 24/7, or at least to our abilities and comfort level. I think you and I agree that doing this for the first time in Felton, where the groundwork is already in place, and seeing how it works, is better than spreading our resources thin in doing this in several places at once before we know the benefits and liabilities
I agree, and I'll remind everyone (including myself) that this is the first attempt at this. There is much that can be picked up and done later on for any and all cities worldwide using Felton as a learning experience whether this event turns out to be extremely successful or not.
At the same time, I think that it's possible Felton might be more successful if others can simultaneously use Felton to coordinate nationally/worldwide. This way, Felton has more activities and more success stories to showcase. This is why I considered in comments elsewhere the "Mission Felton" concept: to take advantage of an expensive effort in as many ways as possible, much how a space voyage is always packed with tons of experiments (and you are reaching for the stars). It may be possible to extending this beyond Felton in some way to allow for more experiments and successes to come out of the effort, meaning "Felton" will have had a bigger impact.
Again, I am not saying that we should go global or national, but I am suggesting that supporting a national or global effort *may* be a Good Thing to do. [See last segment of this reply.]
Later, I'll repost here some of the replies to the original article since there are some ideas there that might be useful, both for the case where we limit to Felton, as well as for other cases.
*****
>> I can't speak for him, but I don't think the reason he is involved in this project is to "simply [get] something really big to happen somewhere." His involvement comes from years of commitment to FOSS, and to imply that he's doing this for the attention is a little shortsighted.
Well, not sure what you mean here, but what I meant was that I think/thought he wanted a big event in Felton vs. a lot of little events in a lot of places (ie, the goal of a Linux Town), enough to not take chances risking the former in order to maybe get the latter, too.
That's roughly what I meant. In either of these cases though, the idea is ultimately to grow Linux, to draw attention to Linux as much as possible over the long haul. [Felton would be principally and maybe exclusively an event to aid general future Linux visibility by way of a focused event around normal people daily use of Linux.]
*****
>> But I can't stop you if you want to do a Lindependence 2008: XXXX on July 4 . I have to leave this somewhat unanswered at this point because I'll have to discuss this with others.
Alright, so you are giving me a maybe. That is good enough for the time being. Absent show of interest and real potential outside of a Felton-only scenario, this would be a mute issue anyway; however, what I was glad to hear was that this effort is not closed and shut but flexible and open to negotiation and ideas.
And I am aware that at this point you guys see anything that may dilute the Felton effort as a potential liability.
We should all keep this in mind as we move forward ("we" meaning mostly those that may want to branch off or rather grow this outside Felton). I will like to start forum discussions here on tuxproject (which is out of the way of the main website) for those that want to consider the ways LINdependence 2008 (TM-ish) can be leveraged by others outside Felton.
Again, good luck, and thanks for the reply.
[For the record, IIRC, when the Linux Town discussions started here, some of you had already been throwing around this idea. The effort here became dormant, but some of those with a walk to walk have started walking.]